I know I have harped on this before, but here it is again.

Person Shocked in Water
Maryville minister recovering after being shocked near houseboat
Posted: Jul 05, 2010 6:01 PM PDT Updated: Jul 06, 2010 9:04 AM PDT
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By JILL MCNEAL
6 News Anchor/Reporter

FRIENDSVILLE (WATE) - A Maryville minister is doing much better after being shocked in the water near her docked houseboat over the holiday weekend.

The Rev. Jewell McCollum is the pastor of Faithway Fellowship in Jesus Name. She was trying to save her 12-year-old granddaughter and another woman, Tiara Dunigan, 20, of Jacksboro, who were shocked first. They were treated and released from the hospital.

McCollum was flown to UT Medical Center because she was unresponsive after being pulled from the water.

"She was the first person I've ever seen shocked in the water," said Charles Edmondson, the long-time marina manager, who has known Rev. McCollum and her husband for several years.

"They're the nicest people we've got here," Edmondson said. "During the summertime, I see them quite often."

He was relieved to learn from family members that McCollum is awake in the hospital now and talking, with only some short term memory problems.

"I saw them doing CPR on her. She was non-responsive lying across the back of the boat," he said. "I helped carry her off the boat onto a stretcher."

People at the dock say the McCollums had been having some recent electrical problems with their houseboat, The Jewell. They say when someone did pull the plug Saturday, cutting the power to the boat, the electric current in the water stopped as well.

"Newer boats come with what's called a ground fault interrupter to where if something like that happens, the breaker will throw inside the boat and cause this not to happen," Edmondson said. "Theirs is an older boat, mid-70s, something like that I believe, and that would be way before there was any kind of safety stuff."

That's one reason Edmondson says he always tells people not to swim in the marina. "The boaters can't see you when they're coming in and out of their slips, and there's a lot of electricity. There are 80 meters here where people are drawing power, just like your house, and if a wire went bad in a boat or something like that, it's going to ground to the water which will make a spot in the water that's highly electric," he said.

TWRA is still investigating.

Jewell McCollum has been released from UT Medical Center. Relatives attribute much of her recovery to the power of prayer.

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Ike
"Don't tell me I can't. Tell me how I can!"
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Edited: 07/06/2010 at 06:08:52 PM by Ike

Ike what is the best way to test for this situation at the water?

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• 1978 57' Carlcraft w/twin 454 350hp Crusaders V-drives
  
  
• 1984 26' Sleekcraft, 502 BBC, 525hp
  
  
• Realtime Weather Aboard The Bama Breeze

Sorry I took so long to answer. I have been traveling to the east coast and back and just plain tired.

Actually you can do it with a volt/ohm meter with a silver anode instead of the usual pointed anode. There was an excllent article about this in Professional Boatbuilder http://www.proboat-digital.com...oat/200612/?pg=1#pg32
click on Tools Of The Trade 2.

Also kevin Ritz has been working to prevent this ever since his son died swimming off a dock. http://www.boatus.com/seaworthy/kritz.asp

There wa another article somewhere that told how to measure this, but I am still looking for it. When I find it I will post it here

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Ike
"Don't tell me I can't. Tell me how I can!"
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Finally. In the Fall 2009 edition of ABYC's magazine Reference Point, was an artical about testing marinas for leakage current. The instruments used were,

A Hioki 3280-20 clamp on meter to test AC and DC voltages,
current availability and for AC leakage determination
An AW Sperry DM-4100 with a reference silver half cell in
the water to determine hull potential.

You can use almost any multimeter with a silver half cell anode to determine electrical current in the water.

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Ike
"Don't tell me I can't. Tell me how I can!"
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Ike,

Maybe you can bring me up to speed on marine electrical grounding.

On my boat the 12VDC negative (black) wiring is connected to the AC ground (green) and neutral so that all of the grounds are common. Is this correct? The generator puts out 220VAC with 110VAC to the neutral. The only problem is that the neutral is also the engine ground to the generator which is also the 12VDC.

Do I have a problem here?

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joetil
50x15 Burns-Craft in South Fla

If I understood you correctly you do not have a problem. But it would be prudent to have an ABYC Certified marine electrician check it. Anyone of the following books should have diagrams similar to your system.

Boating Magazine's Powerboater's Guide to Electrical Systems by Ed Sherman
Boatowner's Illustrated Handbook of Wiring, by Charlie Wing
Your Boat's Electrical System, by Conrad Miller and E. S. Maloney
Boatowner's Mechanical and Electrical Manual, by Nigel Calder

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Ike
"Don't tell me I can't. Tell me how I can!"
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I reread your post. The White is neutral (for 120 v), and the black wire is hot. The green is the grounding wire. 240 volts also has a red wire. This is the neutral for 240 volts. If you do not have an isolation or polarization transformer at the shore power inlet then the green (grounding) and white (neutral) should not be connected together on the boat. If you have a transformer then the green and white are connected at the transformer. But they should not be connected at the ground point. Only the green and the DC negative should be connected at the ground on the engine block.

The generator should have the green and white connected internally, so they do not need to be connected at the ground point.

Without a diagram this is difficult explain. I have not been able to find a diagram I can (legally) copy and post here. I'll keep looking.

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Ike
"Don't tell me I can't. Tell me how I can!"
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Ike I have to disagreee on one point. If you have 240 v you would have two current carrying conductors (probably black and red) they both would be carrying 120 v and the white would be the neutral for either.

Fred

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Yesterday was the best day of my life..... I bought a Houseboat!! Check out our blog of our houseboat refurbish!! http://fredsfriendlyblogspot.blogspot.com/

I have no disagreemnet with that. Each leg, black and white and black to red is 120. You add the two to get 240.

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Ike
"Don't tell me I can't. Tell me how I can!"
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Black to white is 120

Red to white is 120

Black to red is 240

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OLD HOUSEBOATER

Thanks for all of the info. It sounds like I'm OK.

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joetil
50x15 Burns-Craft in South Fla

just to stir the pot-- wouldn't 'black+red to white is 240' be more accurate?

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1988 SkipperLiner 53x14
1995 Tracker Party Cruiser 32
1987 Sea Ray Seville MC 21
2007 Bayliner 175 BR

No, white is the neutral/return leg to 120 volt circuits.

White is not utilized for 240 volts.

For instance: on a stove you have a red , white, black, and a green (ground). Usually a black and a white will service the clock, the light, and oven timer. The red and the black will service the 240 volt burners.

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OLD HOUSEBOATER

Neutral isn't used to achieve 240v when two hot legs are present. There are some "single" legs that carry 240v where you would need the neutral to get 240v. Here is a schematic I made up, though not professional, that shows the wiring of my boat that uses two 120 volts legs and a neutral. The boat is wired for 120v.



-------------------------

• 1978 57' Carlcraft w/twin 454 350hp Crusaders V-drives
  
  
• 1984 26' Sleekcraft, 502 BBC, 525hp
  
  
• Realtime Weather Aboard The Bama Breeze

Edited: 07/12/2010 at 09:14:26 PM by Ej

Here is another one, but not involving a houseboat;

Electrified water zaps four on Burlington waterfront

STAFF REPORT - Published: July 11, 2010

BURLINGTON - Four people were briefly hospitalized Saturday afternoon after a bizarre boating accident electrified the waters around the dock in front of the Burlington Boathouse.

Authorities believe the boat's owner may have accidentally plugged a 120-volt electrical cord into a 240-volt outlet on the dock, triggering a chain of events that ended when two 13-year-old boys and the parents of one of them were taken to the hospital.

Burlington Assistant Fire Marshal Thomas Middleton said the two boys, whose names were not released, were swimming near the dock about 12:30 p.m. when one of them yelled to his father for help. The boy reportedly said it felt like something was "grabbing" him even as he and his companion began to go under water.

The boy's father, who asked not to be named, immediately felt an electric shock when he jumped into the water to help his son, according to Middleton, who said the man was able to lift the boys out of the water despite electricity running through his own body. The man handed the boys off to a bystander before beginning to be overcome by the electricity.

The bystander was also "shocked" when he grabbed the boys and hauled them onto the dock.

Parks department employees working nearby reacted immediately, said Middleton, shutting off the breaker controlling power to the dock and summoning emergency personnel. At about the same time, the owner of the boat disconnected the craft from the electrical outlet.

Once the water was no longer energized, the man's wife and some of the bystanders were able to help him out of the water.

The two boys and the parents of one of them were all taken to Fletcher Allen Health Care, where they were treated and released.

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Ike
"Don't tell me I can't. Tell me how I can!"
New Boat Builders Home Page
My Boating Safety Blog
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I believe this is the ABYV electrical diagram that applies.



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Ike
"Don't tell me I can't. Tell me how I can!"
New Boat Builders Home Page
My Boating Safety Blog
My Boat Building News Blog

Thanks for the great diagrams, they agree with what I have, other than the ground switching relay and the polarization transformer. I'll file them away in the boat stuff. When is the "neutral to ground switching relay" energized?

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joetil
50x15 Burns-Craft in South Fla

Just a reminder, You never, never, never want the ground wire and the neutral wire of a houseboat bonded (connected) to each other. This is probably the number 1 cause of water electrocutions. In a house, the ground wire and the neutral wire are always bonded (connected) at the main breaker panel but this is not so for houseboats. I cannot stress this enough as I have seen this dangerous situation on many many boats.

Good luck to you all!!!!

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Sincerely,
Jason

Miss Sandi

Great point, most people don't understand that the neutral wire in an A/C circuit does have voltage present!!

Fred

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Yesterday was the best day of my life..... I bought a Houseboat!! Check out our blog of our houseboat refurbish!! http://fredsfriendlyblogspot.blogspot.com/

Is that  because  the neutral bus is not truly grounded    as in a land based  application?

Mark    

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Mark
50' 2002 Gibson Classic
How We Roll